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How To Spot An original Print
https://8mmforumworldwide.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=608		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Dan Lail [ Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:36 pm ]
Post subject:  How To Spot An original Print
Okay, how in the heck do can you tell an original print from a dupe or reduction. I mean by looking at the physical film not the image on the screen. This seems to be a well discussed topic over the years, but no one agrees on the answer. Sometimes I run across a lab leader that actually has "dupe" written on it, but this is the exception.
Author:  Mike O'Regan [ Sun Apr 01, 2012 4:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How To Spot An original Print
One way is the examination of printed in splices. A splice which goes across pic and track indicates a dupe.
However, there could of course be a splice which does not go across the track but which got printed into a dupe. Therefore, this can't be an absolute indicator of an original.

Incidentally, the word "dupe" printed into a lab leader would most likely indicate a dupe negative - not a dupe print.

Other giveaways such as the wrong title printed into a leader - such as The Ape Man for King Kong (I'm just making these up for the sake of illustration) - in an effort to avoid detection in the old days.

EMKA leader indicating most likely an original MCA television print.

I've been with Steve Sigel examining prints and he's usually able to tell instantly whether or not we have an original or not. Years of experience is the best tool, I reckon.
:D
Author:  Erik Schoolcraft [ Mon Apr 02, 2012 10:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How To Spot An original Print
I think the best way is to examine both the soundtracks and the film base to which the print is made on. For the most, variable density soundtracks were reprinted with either single or double soundtracks over the years like Blackhawk did in the 70's. I haven't found any variable density reprints as long as I've collected. Also the multiple soundtrack prints (5 tracks or more) were only made during WW2. There were a lot of single track prints made in the late 50's and early 60's so most of those I've found are original. Again though, look at the film's printing marks to find out when the film base was made. This is a wonderful identity mark as to when the film was printed and on what stock.
Author:  Mike O'Regan [ Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How To Spot An original Print
That's it...from everybody???
Discussions rarely go far on this forum. Dan....kick some ass, man. Make 'em talk.
[set5_b/set5_b/toetap05.gif]
Author:  Dan Lail [ Fri Apr 06, 2012 9:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How To Spot An original Print
Quote:
That's it...from everybody???
Discussions rarely go far on this forum. Dan....kick some ass, man. Make 'em talk.


The forum is not yet a year old, but is coming along nicely. Lots of new blood too! Quality is better that quantity sometimes. I'll leave the ass kicking to other venues. [set5_b/set5_b/sifone.gif]
Author:  Mike O'Regan [ Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How To Spot An original Print
Well, Mr L...I consider myself well and truly castigated.
:D
Author:  Wayne Tuell [ Sat Apr 07, 2012 2:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How To Spot An original Print
Mike O'Regan wrote:
That's it...from everybody???
Discussions rarely go far on this forum. Dan....kick some ass, man. Make 'em talk.
[set5_b/set5_b/toetap05.gif]


I think because most of the basic we covered right off the bat and the need to spur some off topic into what "I once found when I could afford it" was left behind. [set5_b/set5_b/rofl.gif]

Just for the sake of the topic, what are your thoughts on printed in cue marks? Never happen, very rare, common
Author:  Mike O'Regan [ Sun Apr 08, 2012 4:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How To Spot An original Print
Well I would've thought they have to be as common as dupes or reductions.

What I find a nuisance is the well-used TV prints with multiple cues of all imaginable types at different places. They can vary from a discrete circle in the corner to a large X scratched into the emulsion. But, at least you know you have an original :D
Author:  Wayne Tuell [ Sun Apr 08, 2012 1:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How To Spot An original Print
I have had plenty punched or scratched in, I was referring to the printed in cue marks from the negatives.
The craziest I have had was a reduction print with printed in cue marks, AND at least four more different sets of cue marks. Punched circles, punched star (I think it was), well made scratched circles that went 3 circles - 2 circles - 1 circle, then a crazy scratch series looks to be a an attempt at a circle. Most were close together which always had me asking WHY? WHY not use the marks from the last projectionist? [set5_b/set5_b/toetap05.gif]
Author:  Mike O'Regan [ Sun Apr 08, 2012 2:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How To Spot An original Print
Quote:
I was referring to the printed in cue marks from the negatives.

I realise that. As I said, they would have to be there in any dupe.

Quote:
WHY not use the marks from the last projectionist?


Absolutely. Apparently, station projectionists had their own particular marks which they stuck by, no matter what was already on there.
:shock:

I recall in my day as a 35mm projectionist, some of the prints we received for showing had white Tippex crosses drawn across the entire frame. This was for identification of reel ends/starts when breaking up/down reels from the larger tower reels. Quite a mess sometimes. In fact, we were encouraged to place little circular store price stickers on the frames which, though we removed them, always left adhesive marks on the frame. There was precious little care taken with those prints in those days in Ireland. I guess I was as guilty as the next man - my misspent youth :oops:
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